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Estimates for Mosque Worshippers Questioned

Attorneys for both Bernards Planning Board and Islamic Society advise houses of worship are permitted in residential zone.

 

Members of the public and the Bernards Planning Board tried on Tuesday to pin down Islamic Society President Ali Chaudry on the number of worshippers who ultimately would attend Friday services at a proposed mosque in Liberty Corner, a number that Chaudry repeatedly estimated at 150 even after about a decade of growth.

Upon questioning, Chaudry said that if the number grew larger, the proposed mosque at 124 Church St. could conceivably consider adding a second service for the mosque's the Friday afternoon worship, which he said is the most attended service in the week.

Chaudry also said that the proposed 4,200-square-foot new building is expected meet the projected needs of the mosque to serve Muslims who live and work within the Somerset Hills and adjoining areas, including suburban towns in Union County. Chaudry added the Islamic Society of Basking Ridge might "reassess" whether it would seek further capacity if the regular attendance ever exceeded that number.

Tuesday's hearing, close to three hours long, drew more than 120 people as the board meeting began. Residents questioned Chaudry, the evening's witness, on everything from whether women or children would be included in daily worship services, scheduled at multiple points during the day, but lightly attended except for the main Friday service, Chaudry said; and also how he came up with a figure of 150 for allowable capaity in the prayer room of the proposed new building. He said that the project's architect and engineer had been asked to design a prayer room with that capacity.

Rob Simon, an attorney for a residents' group, asked whether the planned 50 parking spaces on the property, about four acres, would be sufficient for 150 worshippers if most of those attending would likely be men who might be driving to the site on their own.

Chaudry said some of those attending could be expected to carpool — and that the 50 parking spaces would meet zoning requirements for proposed attendance.

The application before the planning board calls for the demolition of an existing home on the lot near the corner with Somerville Road. That structure would be replaced with a building that Chaudry said will be designed by local architect Dan Lincoln to fit in with the style of historic Liberty Corner Village.

Either Lincoln or the project's engineer, Adnan Kahn, could testify before the Planning Board at the next scheduled hearing at 7:30 p.m. on Oct. 16, said attorney Vincent Bisogno, who represents the Islamic Society.

During Tuesday's public session — a continuation of the formal hearing on the application that began last month — Bisogno reminded the public that a house of worship is permitted within a residential zone, according to municipal zoning ordinances already approved by the Township Committee. Bisogno said the mosque should be treated the same as if it were any other house of worship within the township, including the nearby Liberty Corner Presbyterian Church.

The Planning Board's own attorney, Stuart Koenig, said that the board must approve the application if it is determined to be in compliance with local zoning ordinances. That would be the case even if the proposed use might not be consistent with the municipal Master Plan, which calls for the preservation of the historic village, he said.

"If they are in compliance with the zoning ordinance, but not the Master Plan, [the application] would be approved," Koenig said. He said the board would not legally be permitted to deny such an application on the basis of such concerns as traffic that might be generated by the mosque.

However, Koenig added that the planners could place some reasonable conditions on the proposal.

Following a discussion about whether the mosque, if it is built, might in the future arrange for off-site parking, Bisogno said he would later consult with his client about whether the mosque might limit such parking. He initially noted that the Presbyterian Church on Sunday has congregants parking at a number of nearby commercial lots.

Ultimately, Bisogno said, "The size of the congregation is not relevant. We want people to come to us."

But Chaudry testified that he expects that growth within the Islamic Society's membership and attendance for workship services — now held at the township's community center — would be limited for a number of reasons. For example, he said that there are 10 other Islamic centers also existing within a 25-mile radius of the proposed new location, including multiple locations in Somerset County and three in Plainfield alone in Union County.

Population within Basking Ridge is stabilized since most of the township already is "built out," he said.

Nevertheless, Board Member Ann Parsekian said that the ethnic and religious backgrounds of those within the Somerset Hills could continue to be transformed in years to come.

At the beginning of the meeting, Chaudry had said that the number of Somerset County residents identified as being "adherents" to Islam had grown from 1,891 in the 2000 census to almost 3,300 in the 2010 census.

During a break, Chaudry said the growth in the Muslim population was the reason that the need had developed for a place for those residents to worship close to their homes or jobs. He said that currently the center has about 55 members, and 65 worshippers at Friday services at the community center. He said some of those attending services are from nearby companies, including Verizon Wireless in Basking Ridge.

"This is happening everywhere," he said. "The number of mosques are growing." Islamic services are being held within rented facilities elsewhere in Somerset County, including Somerville, Hillsborough and Bridgewater, he said.

Others, however, said that they believe a Basking Ridge mosque would draw greater numbers if that center actually has its own building.

Meanwhile, resident Tom DeFeo was among those who said that continuing services at the center, which also has a Sunday school for about 25 children, accoridng to Chaudry, would create more traffic on what already is a busy street.

DeFeo expressed scepticism that carpooling would have a significant impact on the number of cars generated by the proposed mosque, particularly on Friday afternoons. "It's the nature of people in this area — we don't carpool," he said.

During the break, neighbor Paul Zubulake said he feels Chaudry already had damaged his credibility by making such claims as testifying before the board in an informal hearing last January that the Islamic Society would renovate the existing home on the property. The society already owns the property.

"It's a horrible location," he said. He added that he already has had five cars pull into his driveway, asking for directions to the mosque even before it is built. He said a mosque definitely would impact local traffic, and Church Street already has a problem with speeding vehicles.

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Related Topics: Bernards Township Planning Board, Islamic Society of Basking Ridge, Liberty Corner, and Mosque

JJ

3:34 pm on Wednesday, September 5, 2012

I live in Liberty Corner and generally don't drive down that portion of Rte. 512. I do however drive past the elementary school and avoid it at peak hours at all costs. Going past the school when students are going in or coming out will delay you 10-15 minutes. I feel bad for the people across the street from the school because when someone is heading east and trying to make a left into the school, everyone else driving eastbound will pass them on the right, usually going off the road and making a big muddy ditch along the edge of someone's front yard.
I have an observation in regards to the traffic generated for the Friday services at the proposed mosque. In my office, my Muslim co-workers leave the office for prayer on Friday. They send a quick email to indicate they are leaving, rush out and then hurry back to their jobs. Mr. Chaudry mentioned staggered services 15 minutes apart. Can you imagine the madhouse this would be in regards to traffic? Trying to get 50 cars in and 50 cars out in 15 minutes with people rushed, trying to get back to work?? I just don't see how this will work in that location.

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God bless America

5:10 pm on Wednesday, September 5, 2012

JJ they could use the other way not to go from in front of the LC school but toward the intersection and from their they can go anywhere! 50 cars will not go in nor out at peak hour, the proposed services as the ISBR president mentioned yesterday were 12:15-1:00 then 1:15-2:00. the peak from LCS starts after 2 PM as you may agree.

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JJ

8:56 am on Thursday, September 6, 2012

My point for mentioning what goes on in front of the school is to indicate that we will possibly have that condition (or worse) further down the block as well. The people who live across the street from the school most probably considered the traffic situation when they bought a home across from a long standing elementary school.
Based on the times that were stated for the proposed services - I believe you would be taking your life in your hands to be in that area between 1:00 and 1:15 on a Friday with 100 cars making a mad dash between their jobs and prayer service.

Laura

6:41 pm on Wednesday, September 5, 2012

Just because something is legally permitted doesn't mean it's the right thing to do. Buying a residential lot with residential neighbors on both sides and then building a house of worship or anything else with a 50 car parking lot is no question going to negatively impact the value of and quality of life at those homes, and the neighborhood. They might have bought property at a more commercial location, but obviously don't care who they impact. Unfortunately, all too common today, and representative of declining civility. Not exactly the "love thy neighbor" approach that we expect from our religious institutions, and a step backward for the tolerance and mutual understanding they are ostensibly aiming for.

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sam

2:23 pm on Thursday, September 6, 2012

good comment. I dont think they care about this neighbourhood. Its all about them and their "rights". Hopefully our elected officials can come up with a solution cause this is very depressing. Put a lot of money and hard work into our house nearby and now this mess?

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JaK

9:01 am on Tuesday, September 11, 2012

HELLO... Why does this thing have to be built in a residential area anyway?Those of you that have homes there stop being so politically correct. protect your investment and quality of life...not only will your homes will lose all value
your neighborhood will change and become a destination point. Not the reason you moved to Basking Ridge!As I recall a few years ago a church wanted to build on buidable site and residents were up in arms, it never got the approvals.Don't be afraid to fight for your family and way of life. IT does not belong in a residential neighborhood. Gosh, try putting a pool in your backyard and see the push back from Bernards Twnship and nieghbors. Well consider this your pool.
BTW when Ali Chaudry was in office the Bernards Twp BOE did not allow a moment of silence on 9/11...Mmmm?

Linda

9:01 pm on Wednesday, September 5, 2012

Let's all remember that Liberty Corner Presbyterian Church is 175 years old!
Anyone who bought a house nearby knew it was part of the neighborhood when they chose to live there. Not so with the Mosque!
What the ISBR is doing is deceitful and Ali Chaudry is abusing his power. He knew the loopholes and how to get around the zoning requirements, etc after having been mayor. I feel horrible for the neighbors (including the school children, small local shops, LCPC, and of course the residents)!!

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JaK

9:03 am on Tuesday, September 11, 2012

Bravo Linda! When Ali Chaudry was in office the BOE did not allow a moment of silence for the victims on 9/11....I submitted an earlier comment and sent a letter to the RHS administration to insure we Never forget. Some thing Ali would like us all to forget and methphorically build on the site where victims lived.

Lesa

10:35 pm on Wednesday, September 5, 2012

I want to know who was asleep at the wheel ... no one in thier right mind could have let this happen. I am mad as hell and i truly hope that all the folks who have spoke to me and who have expressed thier outrage speak up. This simply can not happen!

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Jawce

9:29 am on Thursday, September 6, 2012

most people are scared to death to speak the truth...I am not. You are not. Let's hope the people with the yellow stripe on their back rise up and be accounted for.

Jawce

9:28 am on Thursday, September 6, 2012

the town did NOT allow Millington Baptist to build a big church on Mine Brook Road several years ago.....SO THIS PLACE SHOULD NOT BE ALLOWED EITHER! You are going to see a massive FLIGHT out of Bernards Township if this place is allowed to come into existence! People are too scared to say what they really think but say goodbye to most of your taxpaying population unless you have the balls to NOT allow this

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Annie

11:01 am on Thursday, September 6, 2012

WOW. I think the presence of so many racists and bigots will do more harm to your property values than building an Islamic Center.

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JaK

4:50 pm on Tuesday, September 11, 2012

Annie will your home and way of life be affected?
No...I thought so...zip it!

Jawce

11:14 am on Thursday, September 6, 2012

Anne: how dare you call be a bigot you twit! Don't you realize that the goal of Muslim radicals is to TAKE OVER THE WHOLE WORLD and enforce Sharia law! Are you THAT misinformed!? Do your homework! When radical Islam realized they couldn't win by turning planes into missiles, they are now choosing the way of INFILTRATING our country...you are really naive to think this is not their mission

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Russ

8:05 am on Sunday, September 9, 2012

Hmm, sounds a little over the top to me. Where do you get that information? DIdn't the Quakers "infiltrate" Indian land. Every religion has their extremists. This really shouldn't be part of the conversation.

Jawce

11:16 am on Thursday, September 6, 2012

Anne: i spoke to many homeowners outside of this town meeting and ALL told me they will leave the area! THIS IS THEIR OPINION TOO NOT MINE ALONE! You will get nowhere by calling people names! This is the REALITY

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Russ

8:08 am on Sunday, September 9, 2012

Everyone's going to leave the area? Highly doubtful. I think Anne is absolutely right in her characterization of certain reactions. Get a grip people. Those worshiping here are already your neighbors and co-workers. Focus on the real issue: traffic; one way or the other.

LC

1:24 pm on Thursday, September 6, 2012

You're not alone.We must continue to attend PB meetings and create awareness among our neighbors.Sadly,all the PB can consider is whether ISBR is in compliance with the ordinance.There's a lot of important information we're not allowed to present. For instance, Chaudry is a proponent of Islamic Society of North America (ISNA.) He says so in a Patch article where he warns against "Islamophobia" in response to 9/11.He has a link to ISNA on ISBR's website. ISNA is a front for the Muslim Brotherhood: go to www.discoverthenetworks.org and look up ISNA.To learn about the MB - go to www.victoryinstitute.net and read "The Muslim Brotherhood" by Lt. Col. W. Thomas Smith, Jr - a retired Marine who is a counterterrorism expert. In it, you'll also learn about the Muslim practice of "taqiyya," deceit, condoned and encouraged in the Quran.Raymond Ibrahim, an Islamic scholar who has the advantage of being fluent in Arabic, has written an article called "Tawriya: 'Creative Lying' Advocated in Islam" available on www.gatestoneinstitute.org. I think Chaudry provided us an example of it when questioned by Mr. Orr Tuesday.Another great resource is "Sharia Law for Non Muslims" by the Center for the Study of Political Islam.($8 on Amazon -easy, short read) Read Pamela Geller. Go to ISBRI.org and see their posted Quran verses calling nonMuslims "the worst of beasts" and more. Importantly- let's get together! If on FB - go to PreserveLibertyCorner page so we can unite. They're united-we should be!

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Laura

1:28 pm on Thursday, September 6, 2012

Jawce and Lesa- what's your plan? Repeal the First Amendment?

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LC

1:45 pm on Thursday, September 6, 2012

Oops - another great read: by Anis Shorosh, a Christian Arab who emigrated to the USA in 1967 and has written several books - the article "Islam's 20 Year Plan for U.S." online at www.wnd.com. Read these articles and pass them on. Maybe Anne, especially. ; ) See you all on October 16th - but let's try to connect before then.

By the way - this is in no way an indictment of every Muslim. Not at all. But there is much about Islam (not necessarily every Muslim) that is important to be aware of - and most people accept "it is a peaceful religion" without question. It's imperative that we educate ourselves. Growing up in a Judeo-Christian society, most of us are used to the premise that religion is peaceful. You can also check out www.religionofpeace.com.

All of this aside - the location ISBR has chosen is entirely inappropriate. To wedge such a facility between 2 homes on a 2 lane road is outrageous. So, ask yourself why. And, look up "Victory Mosque." (The LC Firehouse's 9/11 memorial is directly across the street - why do you think those firefighters sit in the front row of the PB meetings - they're not for the mosque, that's for sure.)

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Jawce

1:57 pm on Thursday, September 6, 2012

Laura: the sad thing about a "free" country is that in our dearly held freedoms, we make way for evil to enter...there are no easy answers.......I just know we had two ex-Muslims visit our church and preach on the evils of the Islam religion...how it is not really peaceful...that they say "peace" so they can creep into a country, overtake it through the naivity of the people there.....The two ex-Muslims (now Christians) who came to our church escaped from their Muslim land-of-birth as they were threatened with death for converting to Christianity. It is truly SCARY and horrifying.....we must all be aware of what could happen here!

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Jawce

1:59 pm on Thursday, September 6, 2012

LC - thank you dear LC for writing what you wrote! Unless people EDUCATE themselves, we will no longer be a free country! I am part Native American, and my other ancestors came here from Scotland in the 1690's.....I love this country. However, we have too many head-in-the-sand people now living here and it is truly a sad sad thing

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LC

5:08 pm on Thursday, September 6, 2012

Well, like you said above - we have to speak out. I will not let the charge of being "Islamophobic" stop me from telling the truth. And it is the truth. Everything I've posted is by counterterrorism experts and Islamic scholars. It's not about being against someone for just being different. It does anger me when those like JJ and Annie call names because they have no idea of the kind of person I am. But that's ok, because this is that important.

With regard to immigrants and love of the USA - all the European immigrants I've spoken to about this are horrified to see what is happening in this country. They exclaim: "We left Europe to get away from socialism and Islamization!" People need to pull themselves away from Dancing With the Stars long enough to see what's going on in Europe - or, how about that beautiful "Arab Spring?!" Wake up, folks - it's happening under our noses while we're consumed with consumerism and reality TV - and they know it. It's the perfect storm.

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Russ

8:11 am on Sunday, September 9, 2012

Who has their head in the sand? About what?

Jawce

3:12 pm on Thursday, September 6, 2012

But instead of educating herself, the misguided "Ann" who wrote earlier would rather call me names! How very adult of you, Ann! Let's see who is right 20 years from now.....me with my facts or YOU with your political correctness! And I hope in 20 years, you're not wearing a BURKA!

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logical thinker

3:52 pm on Thursday, September 6, 2012

JJ
Too much traffic, land values going down because of a commercial enterprise being built . . . these are legitimate concerns to be addressed. I love this town but I am a little disappointed by some of this "Archie Bunker" / anti-muslim sentiment. I though we were better than that.

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JaK

4:36 pm on Tuesday, September 11, 2012

So very righteous of you!!

Jawce

4:29 pm on Thursday, September 6, 2012

JJ - have you read the earlier posts? How dare you call people who want the TRUTH "archie bunkers"......you are a dingbat AND a meathead

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LC

4:59 pm on Thursday, September 6, 2012

Haha - you said it better than I. It's very frustrating to be called names by those who are too lazy to learn the facts. They are holier than thou - "anti-Muslim?" Did I not CLEARLY state it was NOT about Muslims, but about Islam? There is a difference, you know. (But, Annie and JJ would have to think to understand it.) Former Muslims are the best people to talk about it - I've heard them speak, too. I am sure Annie and JJ will not even bother to go to the articles I listed - they don't fit their narrative. Jawce - have you heard of Eric Allen Bell? If not, he is a filmmaker who set out to make a pro-mosque film with regard to the 50,000 square foot mosque in TN - he made fun of Christians and thought anyone against the mosque was a bigot. Well, as he was making the film, he ended up learning about Islam and is now a huge voice for anti-Sharia (NOT anti-Muslims) Google him - he has a great website: Global Infidel TV. I wish more people would open their minds and become educated. Our futures (and especially those of our children and theirs) depend upon it.

Jawce

4:30 pm on Thursday, September 6, 2012

JJ, "better than that".....you mean "OMG someone is not politically correct!" Do you want your kids or grandkids to someday be under SHARIA LAW? Do your homework! You are one of the blind ones that are being fooled and I feel sorry for you

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JJ

7:42 pm on Thursday, September 6, 2012

One thing to note, there are 2 JJ's posting here. I posted the 2 comments about the 15-minute-100-car-exchange in between services at the mosque.
Another JJ posted the comment with the Archie Bunker reference.
JJ-1 (as I will now be known)

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LC

7:57 pm on Thursday, September 6, 2012

JJ1 - I thought that last comment seemed odd. Haha. I can understand wanting to clear that up. I also want to say that Laura and Sam had great points. It was very interesting to watch Chaudry's face as the gentleman from Somerville Rd, whose home is adjacent to the proposed mosque, implored him: what about my family? When he mentioned the headlights in his window, Chaudry pretty much insinuated he was lying. This is what they do- force their ways. Look at the King of Kings Church and the Jewish Temple over by the Y- both fairly recent additions to town. They respectfully chose more commercial locations near the highway and main roads.

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Russ

8:12 am on Sunday, September 9, 2012

Character assassination.

Jawce

8:52 pm on Thursday, September 6, 2012

LC - thanks for all the info. I could not stay till the end of the meeting due to my elderly relative who wanted to leave. I just know that one Sunday a few years ago, our church in Basking ridge hosted 2 ex-Muslims (from Virginia I believe) who had escaped their middle eastern nation and (in addition to writing a book), spoke about their ordeal...how they had converted to Christianity, how they HAD to leave their country or be killed or imprisoned...etc. We were allowed NO photo-taking of them...it was due to their need to still be secretive as they feared for their life! WHAT KIND OF RELIGION KILLS ITS OWN PEOPLE FOR CONVERTING! It is totally heart breaking

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God bless America

7:02 am on Friday, September 7, 2012

JJ: when I say the church in the street, I do not mean the reason that Mosque should be built, but I mean it is the most commercial street in the neighborhood! one of the planning board memebers not from public said in the public hearing "in the street down town Liberty corner" he called it down town Liberty corner. as ISBR said the Friday service will be one a week and if more than 50 cars came they will start another service before not after to avoid the traffic!

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God bless America

7:05 am on Friday, September 7, 2012

Laura: we do care of neighbors, and I guess ISBR does. because after the public hearing I sent to ISBR that Friday service can be held even before 12 noon, and they asked me of my resources which I shared with them! this is not for public but it shows that we care! and also the comers to the Friday service do not want to be stuck in the street for 30 minutes, so we have this weekly service not at the peak time with school, and as I said the comers might add congustions first few weeks but then they will learn to go the alternative routes not from in front the school at LC

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God bless America

7:12 am on Friday, September 7, 2012

Jawce: never forget 9/11 has nothing to do with Muslims! this is not a hole in the system as Linda is saying. we hate what happened in 9/11 as much as you do! this was a harmful incident executed by morons, it has nothing to do with what Muslims think, you mentioned ICNA, Muslims brotherhood etc etc. this is a long discussion but I just like to be brief and not dive in details: WHAT ANY INDIVIDUAL COULD SAY DOES NOT REPRESENT THE RELIGION. you said this was christian/Judi country, do you want me to mention what "some" CHristians/Jewish said about others? no I do not want to, who ever does mistake doing or saying it is his own mistake, but when we talk about religion we talk about the orders that came from the religion itself, for me I can live with christians and Jewish because I have inner peace and I do not imagine the bad few christians among them! remember the wisconsin shooter is christian! I do not say christians are this and that I say he is moron!

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God bless America

7:18 am on Friday, September 7, 2012

Jawce: why residents want to leave? remember those few Muslims live here,wanted to be here! they like the town, and they like the neighborhood! they had the choice to live in other towns with more Muslims in neighborhood, but they chose this town and they like it as it is!! no target for them to be majority but to live with others! I persoanlly suggested many activities to ISBR to include our neighbors (not Muslims but all) guys this is a COMMUNITY CENTER in the are, it is like the church, it could be whatever church in the town, but all residents can use it not only those who follow this church right? same for this Mousque, this to be the place to educate our young Muslims about Islam and to make bridges with neighbors! no body has to leave! nobody wants anybody to leave! we need to live together! please understan

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God bless America

7:25 am on Friday, September 7, 2012

Jawce and LC: with all my respect you do not know much about Islam and Sharia! I personally volunteer to explain things, and I can visit you at home and explain this to you, be careful guys read what you wrote and ask yourself, is this right thing? do you write the same to insult christian lady if she became a mum? do you call it BURKA in a funny way? you guys keep sayign to others educate your self and do your home work, I would say you do your home work! and please do not start copy/paste links to me like last time, Islam is not what is written on google as much it is not what FOX news shows as much as it is not what you beleive!

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God bless America

7:27 am on Friday, September 7, 2012

LC: regardless what doctor Chaudry responded to the neighbor regarding the lights, you need to understand 1 fact: the Mosque is not built yet! they will build a fence, and new bulsing and the town should approve it. if the neighbor is annoyed by lights now he should have been annoyned be the Ex-neighbors in the house as the setup is still the same! be reasonable people

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LC

9:35 am on Friday, September 7, 2012

Be reasonable? So, according to your "reasoning," living next door to one family with one or two cars is equal to living next door to a Mosque with fifty parking spaces? Interesting. I'm not sure how dumb you people think we are, but no one believes Chaudry's numbers. That was obvious at the last meeting. If over 125 men were at Jumma at Dunham park in July, it's clear the mosque will be attracting many people early on - 150 in ten years is laughable. In your "reasonable estimation," the man from the corner should be happy with a "fence and (I guess you meant to say 'bushes' - it seems you struggle with the language) 'bulsing' sic" This is a small example of Islam forcing its way onto us. The ISBR obviously had/has no interest in cooperating with the community. The interfaith meetings are a joke and a construct of ISNA, creating a false appearance of assimilation and too many Americans, churches, and synagogues have fallen for it. Well, America had better wake up. It's called stealth jihad. JJ may feel safe because no one has had their head chopped off in the USA. But the Sharia creep is of equal cause for concern, because it is the beginning of much worse. But, folks - don't take my word for it - read the articles I posted.

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JaK

4:47 pm on Tuesday, September 11, 2012

No interest. We live in the United States of America. We have our laws in place...follow the established laws or go to where your Sharia laws rule. I guess you would probably have to go somewhere in the middle east in a country of your choice that will provide the Sharia laws you so desire!
Calling him docotor presumes he is a man of integrity and ethics. Please don't do that it makes you appear even more of a subseverant follower of laws from the biblical times.!

Jawce

7:45 am on Friday, September 7, 2012

GOD BLESS AMERICA: that Wisconsin shooter was a GENTILE, not a Chrisitian. A Christian is someone who asks Jesus into their heart & becomes a new Christian, he becomes like Jesus in his ways.......and you are mixing apples with oranges here. The Islam religion seeks to KILL the INFIDEL and wants to take over the entire world, creating SHARIA LAW.......if we were scared of communism in the 1950s and 1960s, this SHARIA LAW IS FAR FAR WORSE! I think you are a big fat liar, God Bless America.....don't put on patriotic airs with your phony pen name either. I've talked to ex-Muslims and ISLAM is a religion of hate, of stoning women and keeping them like slaves. The Christian religion believes in Love, and turning the other cheek. A Christian "witnesses" to another person about his faith, but if that person doesn't want to hear it, Jesus told us to end it right there. There is no FORCE INVOVLED.....Islam is a religion of FORCE and HATE> I have educated myself, that is why I know these things!

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Jawce

7:51 am on Friday, September 7, 2012

to all of you there: just because someone is a white Caucasian living in the USA does NOT make them a Christian! We are a country of godless people for the most part....however, the Christians that are around DO NOT force their faith on anyway! Jesus commanded us Not to...nothing is forced. We believe in Love Thy Neighbor. However, I will attest from ones I know that ISLAM i have read about is scary....very scary.....BEHEADINGS, killing women, keeping women as second-class-citizens. HORRIBLE JUST HORRIBLE

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Russ

8:17 am on Sunday, September 9, 2012

How are any of these people forcing their religion. Looks like they are going through the proper legal channels. And Evangelical Christians do seek to convert others to Christianity. You can't make general sweeping generalizations about a religion as large as Islam. You are just fearing what you really don't know about very well. Plus this line of discussion is so anti-American. Freedom of Religion except for Muslims? Really?

God bless America

8:11 am on Friday, September 7, 2012

Jawce: that is very wrong about Islam, Muslims do NOT force or i mpose their beleive and it is mentioned many many times in Quran. women is equal with men since 1500 years, killing a single human being (muslim or not) is a crime in Islam. all what you are saying is what you THINK of ISLAM. thanks to your resources! and you ask people to do their homework. again you please do your home work.

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God bless America

8:14 am on Friday, September 7, 2012

Jawce: Islam is nothing of what you are saying and you have no idea what is SHARIA at all. Muslims do not aim to take over the world as you say, Muslims are less than 1%in USA, and writers used to anticipate Muslims will be more than 10-20% more than 40 years ago! it is just what people scare each other from.

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God bless America

8:16 am on Friday, September 7, 2012

differece between you and me is here: I offered to come to your house and talk as a neighbor. you called me big fat liar! if these are your manners no wonder why you are against the project.

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logical thinker

8:34 am on Friday, September 7, 2012

I am the JJ who referenced archie bunker, sorry for the confusion. I will change my handle.

If you read the papers and listen to the news today, and every day, you will hear about people who grew up 'christian' killing other christians in inner cities, suburbs . . . . everywhere over drugs and jealousy etc. I haven't heard of any local beheadings or women being tortured by Muslims here in NJ . . . have you? Sure it happens in the Middle East and that's tragic. But Christians have been killing christians in Ireland for decades too. What's wrong with taking your family away from all that and coming to America to be free? That's how the Mayflower got here in the first place. To pigeon-hole all muslims is so backwards and small-minded. To me, the risk of showing our kids illogical intolerance is much bigger than the risk of a local beheading in Somerset County.

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JaK

9:08 am on Tuesday, September 11, 2012

STOP the nonsense!!! This is ridiculous !! How many of you righteous supportersof the building have homes in the nieghborhood? Will you be impacted other than your finely honed righteousness?.

LC

9:01 am on Friday, September 7, 2012

Wow. The ignorance is staggering. So you feel safe because no one has been beheaded in NJ. I am running out now but will be glad to post about the rise of honor killings in the USA later. In fact, a Muslim father wanted for killing his daughter for being too Western is suspected to be hiding out in Paterson. I'm not even reading "God Bless America's" (great tag -cough cough) comments-I know who and what he is. And so- as long as Innocent people are killed and tortured overseas in the name of Islam- that is ok with JJ, apparently. Mind you- I am talking about innocent MUSLIMS, too. But I'm like Archie Bunker? Haha

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Russ

8:21 am on Sunday, September 9, 2012

Your talking about an issue of culture here, not religion. And honor killings in the US are no more rampant than young kids bringing guns to school and shooting other kids. Neither is a good argument against kids or Islam.

God bless America

9:48 am on Friday, September 7, 2012

no LC it is SAFE because there is a law! even if some one been beheaded by Muslims it is not ISLAM's fault! as much as the shooting happens by Christians is not Christianity fault not Jesus fault! you do not know me, but I am not hidden, I can meet you anywhere and discuss. my goal by inviting you is NOT convince you by Islam but to convince you that the true Islam is built on diversity as this country is too! so we do not want a closed Muslim community we want to live here with you spread love and tolerance together! we know that we can go live in Paterson, Edison and have Muslim neighborhood, but for us we like and want to live together and share our neighborhood with our great christian and jewish neighbors.

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LC

10:15 am on Friday, September 7, 2012

I have read the Quran, GBA - so your words are wasted on me. I don't even have to read the Quran to know the true intent of ISBR. On your own website www.ISBRI.org - LOOK IT UP, PATCH READERS - you have Quran verses warning about the "Character of Non Believers," warning against taking us into your friendships and describing us in horrible ways, and another on "Defence," calling us "the worst of beasts." So - I think I'll pass on that little get together. And - may I add, those verses are nothing compared to many others in the Quran. AND - therein lies the difference. You all love to point to random Caucasian killers (Tim McVeigh, etc) and use them as examples of Christian evil doers - but, as Jawce pointed out, they are not following the Christian way - the BIble. The Quran, the Hadith, the word of Mohammed - those are the things you all are commanded to follow. And, please - lets not go back centuries to the Crusades, as I know some liberal is probably gearing up to do! Have a great day - I'm going to install some "Preserve Liberty Corner" signs.

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JJ

11:25 am on Friday, September 7, 2012

JJ1 here.
I have friends with the same strong feelings as LC and Jawce. I would dismiss them for the most part because I just couldn't imagine such a massive, insidious movement. I did take a look at what was on the ISBR's website. I realize the Quran was written in ancient times and won't ever be changed. I wouldn't think that the things that LC mentioned above were practiced in a modern religion, If I am thinking right, then why is it that these statements are proudly included on a website in the U.S. of A. in the year 2012? It is a little unnerving. It's no wonder that people are unsure about this religion.

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LC

12:45 pm on Friday, September 7, 2012

JJ1 - thanks for being open minded enough to actually look for real information. I hope you will now go to some of the other links I provided. There is a lot of information out there. Again - I'm not directing you to angry blogs, etc. Okay - well, www.religionof peace.com is pretty hardcore - but it is factual. A great guy to read about is Eric Allen Bell - the screenwriter who was pro mosque and ridiculed the mosque opponents - until he stumbled upon the truth in his research. Look him up on Facebook, Google him, or go to GlobalInfidel.TV

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Russ

8:27 am on Sunday, September 9, 2012

You need to re-read your Old Testament. There are out-modded ideas there just as well. Such as being allowed to sell your daughter into slavery. Christians that kill are non-believers and not real Christians, while Muslims that kill are following the Quran? The Old Testament treats non-believers the same way, like turning them into salt among other things.

God bless America

11:17 am on Friday, September 7, 2012

so whoever does evil work you simply say he does not follow the christ and the bible! why can not I say he does not follow the Quran? for those verses, you can not pick a verse from its place and just read the translation, all these verses mentioned in occasions, so you will find in Quran describing "jewish" is this and that that does not apply for all JEWISH, but for only the incident that happened at that time that is hard to explain here and this is why I said get together. I just want to say if you are against ISLAM , Quran, Mohammed etc etc. Muslims are not against Christians, or Jesus or Mosus, for the matter of fact, Muslim MUST beleive in all of prophets in the same level, meaning if Muslim beleive in Quran and Mohammed, but he/she does not beleive in Jesus or Moses and their message he/she is not even a Muslim! this is not being nice, this is not lie, you can ask any single Muslim of this. yes go install some signs, I can just pray and say "May God preserve Liberty corner"

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logical thinker

11:23 am on Friday, September 7, 2012

Once upon a time, I believed there was a guy in a red suit and a white beard and he stopped time at midnight and came through chimneys all over the planet and delivered toys to all the good kids. Then I grew up and realized that's ridiculous. Do you still believe in Santa Claus? Do you believe in the Easter Bunny? I am sure the answer is no. So why then do you still believe the a similar crazy story about a guy up in the sky that knows everything and sees everything and sent a son 2,000 years ago etc etc? its just as illogical. All religions are pretty silly if you step aside and take a look at it. Jesus was a brilliant thinker and very spiritual man. If you live your life as he taught you will live a great life and spread love to all. That's how I try to live. I don't need to believe that if I do bad I will go to hell. I try to do good deeds because I know they are right - it feels right.

Jesus would be appalled that people are hating in his name. That people made up a story about him. That people used the EXACT story of Horus (An ancient mythical Egyptian god) that was told 1,000 BC about a guy born of a virgin, was baptized by a guy who was beheaded, who performed miracles, died of crucifixion and rose from the dead.

All religions, however silly and illogical they may be, should at least help people feel good and spread love...when its used for hate and "my religion is right and your religion is evil" then I feel the need to speak up.

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God bless America

11:46 am on Friday, September 7, 2012

Dear Logical thinker: the fact that some one beleive in one religion does not mean he is right and others are wrong. you are absolutely right, if we live like Jesus we will live a great life, and that is the need for a Mosque! we need a mosque to teach kids about Mosus, Jesus and Mohammed, teach them the fact you are Muslims have nothing to do that others wrong, teach them that if some one does bad deeds we do NOT judge him, we ask for God mercey for her and for us! the fact that you do not beleive in reilgions is very welcomed by all religions and by the law in this country! Neither Muslims nor Christians ENFORCE anybody to follow! I go to Mosues and churchs because I am religions! I ask my God for good for me, my family, you and the all humans. God bless you and us

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Laura

2:56 pm on Friday, September 7, 2012

Interesting as this theological debate might be, the issue isnt about permitting the existence of mosques in the USA. It's about traffic, noise, changing the residential character of the block, peaceful enjoyment if ones home, privacy, too much pavement, sanitation (will they need a commercial dumpster?), etc. attacking the free exercise of religion (however "justified" that might be) only makes the argument that these other things are only being raised because of discrimination, and doesn't further the ultimate goal, which is to get them to go to a more appropriate site.

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Jawce

3:08 pm on Friday, September 7, 2012

Logical thinker: The Bible says "the fool hath said in his heart there is no God". I hope you're not a fool! I am an old lady and trust me, Jesus Christ is real, He died on the cross and rose again for our sins and He is alive and answers prayer! He has helped me get through a troubled life! He has miraculously intervened ! He is the one True Son of God, not a God to be feared like "allah".....(which in my opinion is a false "god"). I worship the God of Moses, Abraham and Isaac! I hope "logical thinker" you don't equate my TRUE fear of the scary Islamic religion with hating the poor deceived people who follow such an erroneous teaching. If you are truly a "logical thinker," look into Jesus Christ! He is indeed the way, the truth and the light!

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Jawce

3:10 pm on Friday, September 7, 2012

God bless America: sir, first of all your writing is atrocious. Second of all, I repeat: in any country where the Islam religion takes over, there is nothing but the following: stoning and killing of women, beheading people who don't agree with the religion, hatred and murder. ALL the Islamic countries are NO places to live! It is a religion from the PIT OF HELL

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God bless America

3:35 pm on Friday, September 7, 2012

Laura: I totally agree, the topic must be traffic, parking, lighting, noise and environmental effects only this is the job of the planning board not to discuss the allowance of the Islam as religion. For that I announce if the planning board disapprove for one of those environmental reasons I personally surely will accept and also SUPPORT this decision. I am clarifying to all what true Islam is, because our neighbors took the discussion there to be not to accept the Mosque because they do not want Islam to take over the world!

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God bless America

3:49 pm on Friday, September 7, 2012

Jawce: sorry for my language, I am using another keyboard now and hope I will do better job! Thanks for the nice word you used to describe my writing, is this something you have learned from bible? I doubt it, because I know what Jesus asked people to do and how to guide each other to the righteous path. I will do as Jesus peace be upon him taught me and forgive you and not answer to you in same language.
Second: Allah is the same God; he is the one who Abraham, Isaac, Moses, Jesus and Mohammed worshipped. Not important to agree with that, but you should know that what all Muslims believe in! I will be considered NON-MUSLIM if I believe in Mohammed ONLY.
Having people killed in Muslims countries have nothing to do with Islam, want me to consider the civil war in America and judge Christianity or jusge Americans? Or you want me to judge Catholic/protestants for the world war II? NO I WONT those are wars between people regardless their religion, most of Muslim countries now do not consider themselves Islamic countries and they do NOT obey SHARIA but the French law.

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God bless America

3:57 pm on Friday, September 7, 2012

LC: I went with my neighbor to pick his son up from LCS today and just came back, we have arrived there 2:35 PM and picked his son up at 3:16PM, I think you know how is the traffic at Church street between 2:30 to 3:30 with school buses, cars etc. despite these facts, the 3-4 neighbors just across the school have the signs “preserve liberty corner” so they are not annoyed by the traffic from the school but they are annoyed by the 50 or 60 or 75 cars will go to the Mosque ONCE A WEEK not every day like the school, and just PASS in front of them and park and go inside the Mosque not stay in the cars . This is what I meant by being reasonable! You already announced your thought that it is about Islam not about traffic or parking so you are reasonable! But I was answering the people talking about Parking and traffic!

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LC

4:03 pm on Friday, September 7, 2012

Laura, you are certainly correct with regard to the current application before the planning board. Our discussion did veer off onto the topic of Islam, which I think is understandable. Frankly, I think it's a shame and unjust that we cannot have an open discussion of ISBR's possible connections and intent in an open forum. But, yes, for the purpose of the planning board, we must focus on whether they are compliant with the ordinance.

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LC

4:18 pm on Friday, September 7, 2012

GBA - I never said Preserve Liberty Corner signs were protesting Islam. My beliefs about Islam are personal. Residents are protesting at the planning board based on the ordinance. And- the school has been there for decades. People bought their houses in a RESIDENTIAL district, knowing there was already a church, bakery, school, etc down the road. Again- we digressed on this thread. Your "reasoning" that since people accept the school traffic but don't want the added Mosque traffic, they must be anti-Muslim just makes no sense.

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maria claps

4:48 pm on Friday, September 7, 2012

Annie~extremely stupid comment. Just because people have strong feelings and are against the mosque does not make them racists and bigots!

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LC

10:45 am on Tuesday, September 11, 2012

Thank you, Maria. And may I point out that those "strong feelings" are based upon facts.

God bless America

4:54 pm on Friday, September 7, 2012

LC: my point is people accept the school traffic which is way more than the proposed Mosque traffic means there must be another thing drives the protesting. This what I said

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God bless America

5:05 pm on Friday, September 7, 2012

maria claps: agreed protesting the Mosque has nothing to do with being racisst, I just started responding to people saying it is not about traffic or about environment it is about Islam

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LC

6:47 pm on Friday, September 7, 2012

That is only your opinion GBA and you get to have one here in America. In fact, most Muslims claim the same thing when people object to mosques moving into their neighborhoods. Again- everyone who lives in LC moved in KNOWING the school, etc wee ALREADY there. What don't you understand about that? ISBR wants to turn a HOUSE into a MOSQUE- that is the problem.

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God bless America

7:51 pm on Friday, September 7, 2012

LC: I understand, the school was there 50 years ago, the church was there 200 years ago, people moved while they were there the MOSQUE is not there and it was house am I correct?
I am just saying the street is already commercial; the traffic jam is very high caused by the school not by having a Mosque, even if 100 cars came to the Mosque each Friday afternoon once a week that would not add any measurable traffic because:
1. Traffic for those 100 cars will come into 2 patches before the school peak hour
2. This traffic will be distributed over 2 hours : from 11-1 or from 12-2
3. No serious traffic toward the church on Friday afternoon as most church services are at night other than Sunday mornings.
4. Traffic from those 100 cars over 2 hours period is not comparable with the school traffic (school was there, people bought knowing etc. etc.)

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LC

7:56 pm on Friday, September 7, 2012

My last comment: The street is RESIDENTIAL. You really are a twisted thinker.

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God bless America

8:02 pm on Friday, September 7, 2012

To ALL: do you know what bother me personally? It is not a mosque, no, I live here for 4 years and no Mosque and I am fine! I pray at home, and I pray at the rented place and I can live this way for the rest of my life, but back to the question do you know what bothers me from this debate? I will tell you:
1. I have been in Dubai for years, I have had many Americans friends and still have them, you consider yourself the most free country in the world, and I am comparing in my head the differences when Christians or Hindu or any people wanted to build a temple or a church in Dubai with what you are doing!
2. From knowing some Americans even before moving here, I have a bright nice picture for Americans, which I am proud to live next to them! And I am telling how nice are Americans and how tolerable and open minded and non-discriminators they are! I go overseas and tell nice stories about my neighborhood. Now you are breaking this image at least in my head! But I am resisting and telling myself “NO AMERICANS ARE GREAT, THIS IS JUST FEW PEOPLE’s OPINION AND THEY ARE MISGUIDED” but with that I feel a tiny small thing has been changed in my heart!
3. I DO NOT WANT TO LIVE IN A CLOSED MUSLIM COMMUNITY, I want to live with you guys I swear to GOD I do! If I wanted to live next to Muslims I can do that now and move 30-40 minutes! But I want to live next to you why don’t you want to live next to me?!

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Laura

8:48 pm on Friday, September 7, 2012

No one has said they don't want to live next to you. You are welcome to live in the house, just not to change it to a public facility. You miss the whole point.

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Jawce

10:16 pm on Friday, September 7, 2012

GBA sounds like one sick dude. Very sick dude. It's downright scary

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Sick of it All

12:33 am on Sunday, September 9, 2012

This entire discussion just boils down to three words – “common sense” and “survival”. Most “rational” American’s do not want Islam spreading in America, and I believe, based on voraciously reading and studying history, as well as world affairs since 9/11, for a very good reason. The tenants of Islam have absolutely nothing to do with our American traditions, our history, our founding principles, or even the very Judeo-Christian traditions of tolerance, born in Europe during the enlightenment and later fully realized in America, that make it possible for Muslims to come here and worship freely in the first place.
As far as this Mosque being built - put all of the legalese and all of the bull crap aside - weather it’s legal, Illegal, the zoning laws etc. etc. – people, good people, just doesn’t want their Nation and neighborhoods being destroyed by this phenomenon.
If you actually spend some time to follow world affairs and see what is going on in Europe – you will see today that Muslims have already started using the European legal systems and traditions and laws of tolerance, where they have set foot, to turn their host Nations laws upside down creating in effect a backdoor to implement Sharia law and the seeds of intolerance. The bottom line here and the real solution to the problem is that we need leaders with courage to start stepping up to the plate in reforming our self-destructive and suicidal immigration laws before it is too late.

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LC

8:45 am on Sunday, September 9, 2012

Thanks for your informed comment, SOIA. I'm sick of this thread, frankly, but jumped back in just to say thanks and it's good to know others are informed about the truth of political Islam (I'm sure you know very little of the Quran is about "worship" and most of it is about how to deal with non-believers.) A fool like Russ injects himself by calling names and pulling up references form thousands of years ago to point a finger at other religions (as I predicted someone would do.) I'm more concerned with Islam's twenty year plan for the current century. As we sit in our homes this morning, people (Muslims, too) are being raped, tortured, and killed in the name of Islam. I can tell from your comment that you understand. Please attend all planning board meetings and join the mailing list at www.btcrd.org to receive update. Have a nice day. : )

God bless America

7:39 am on Sunday, September 9, 2012

To Sick of it all: Muslims in USA is 0.6% do you call this Islam is spreading? You want the leaders to step up and change immigration laws to what exactly? Prevent only Muslims from immigrate? I am not going to comment on the tragedy of 9/11 again as we said you cannot measure for an incident and make your judge cause many other nations can do that too, Iraqi’s can think same way toward Americans after USA occupied Iraq and killed 1.5 million Iraqis and afterwards Mr. president said “Sorry we did not find nuclear weapons!”.
I have 3 questions for you:
1. What about other Immigrants? Do they have something to do with American’s traditions more than Muslims?
2. Do you have example how Muslims are turning the laws upside down in Europe?
3. Do you have an example of “Sharia” law that Muslims tried to impose here in USA or in any other non-Muslim country? And what is that law so you are so terrified of it?

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Jawce

9:39 am on Sunday, September 9, 2012

Russ is a real misinformed individual. He must not read the newspapers. The Islamists who are infiltrating Europe are causing a terrible problem. Also, he compares evangelical Christianity with FORCED SHARIA LAW? Is he for real? Did you ever see an evangelical Chrisitan FORCING their religion down your throat? What planet did you come from? As I stated earlier, Jesus taught us to tell people about our faith & if they didn't want to hear it, to depart peacefully .....Go to Saudi Arabia and try to practice your Jewish or Christian faith! You will be persecuted. If you are an Arab & you convert to Judiasm or christianity, THEY WILL KILL YOU. THIS IS A VERY VERY DANGEROUS AND INTOLERANT RELIGION. If Russ wants to support it so much, why doesn't he move to Saudi Arabia or Iran or Egypt or Libya? We heard the minority of christians who live in Egypt are being persecuted too! BY THE MUSLIMS THERE. THIS IS NOT WHAT WE WANT INFILTRATING OUR COUNTRY

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Russ

9:40 am on Sunday, September 9, 2012

Very interesting LC, you say I "inject" myself by 'calling names" (where pray tell?) and then you call me a fool. Tisk, tisk. I am very honored to be called a fool by someone who writest the types of posts you do. As far as pointing fingers, you seem to be doing the most of anyone here on that score. I simply pointed out a fact. Would you like chapter and verse? And how is that not appropriate? You certainly are doing a lot of it. And about this 20 year plan. Where exactly can one find this?

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Jawce

9:40 am on Sunday, September 9, 2012

whoever removed the misinformed and misguided name-calling Russ from this forum, i thank you.

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Jawce

9:43 am on Sunday, September 9, 2012

Russ.....you must not be reading our posts...have you read the sites LC pointed out? Have you ever talked to ex-Muslims who escaped to this country because they were persecuted & threatened with death when they converted to another religion? They could no longer stay in their home country because ISLAMIC COUNTRIES HAVE ZERO TOLERANCE for non-Muslims. ZERO. And their plan is to take over the entire world & force their RELIGION DOWN OUR THROATS.....after chopping heads off I may add

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LC

10:09 am on Sunday, September 9, 2012

Clearly, Russ- as most foolish people whi speak about subjects they know nothing of, you didn't even bother to read my post referencing the article by Anis Shorrosh, a Christian Arab, and an Islamic scholar. I even gave a link to the article. But, rather than reading it and considering the facts presented in it, you call me a bigot and accuse md of character assassination for describing Chaudry's reaction to questioning. So, all through this thread, I've provided facts and references in my discussion if the issue and you jump in with name calling and a mention of violence from the Old Testemant. Your ignorance of the difference in practice of Judeo/Christian religions with that of Islam is evident. Several times I have mentioned I am not anti Muslim- many innocent Muslims are being killed, raped, and tortured in the name of Islam, along with Christians, Hindus, and Jews. But- I predict you will not read anything I posted and continue to call me a bigot.

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SZ

11:02 am on Sunday, September 9, 2012

GBA - Is there a reason that a more appropriate location in town cannot be found for the mosque? I object to the location, but not to the practice of the religion or to having a mosque in town as I have co-workers & friends who will probably take advantage of the services. Why choose a location that will have a negative impact on the adjoining and neighborhood residential homes? I don't think you would get this type of negative response if you chose a commercial location, similar to the location mentioned for King of Kings Church and the Temple over by the Y.

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LC

10:47 am on Tuesday, September 11, 2012

SZ - I happen to know-for a FACT- that ISBR has been offered a large sum of money to move the site. They did not accept. It's a victory mosque - and be damned with the neighborhood. I was at the 9/11 memorial at Dunham Park yesterday. Every person who dedicated a stone at that memorial should be at the meetings.

God bless America

1:15 pm on Sunday, September 9, 2012

SZ: I was not involved in choosing the location, so I do not want to defend the location. Now is there a better location to build a Mosque? I really do not know, and I do not know where are those 2 locations of that proposed church and temple. I live in Basking ridge now for 3 years and from what I see, I do not see a commercial street in the meaning of there is NO HOUSES in it same as in big cities like NYC. You can see houses in the downtown Basking ridge and Houses in this church street too. And each time I mention this that there are houses in the street along with church, coffee shop, firedepartment, public school, shops they start telling me those were there for long and start attack Islam (unlike you) for me I am so open to sell this land and have any other place and if it is better I would support it, and I am sure many others would do.

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SZ

2:35 pm on Sunday, September 9, 2012

GBA - The King of Kings Worship Center is 219 Mt. Airy Rd in a commercial location (right off Exit 26 of Rt 287). The temple is adjacent to the same commercial location as King of Kings, but 40 Whitenack Rd. I believe there is a house on the other side of the temple,but with a good amount of property/distance between the house and the temple. Also the temple's parking is adjacent to the commercial side, not the private home owner so it seems less intrusive. I would recommend driving by those locations to see the difference. My advice is to sell this location and focus on finding a more appropriate location in the area for the mosque.

God bless America

1:22 pm on Sunday, September 9, 2012

Jawce: no matter what you say, you will never to be able to hide the truth. I am from a Muslim country where 8% are Christians, and never heard any one of them complained, I have been in Egypt for years and Christians are not being discriminated , you said it ‘you heard’ they are, but have you been there? This is what FOX NEWS and CNN want you to know. I lived for years in Lebanon and 35% are Christians, and I as Muslim NEVER been in Lebanon but lived in places with Christians majority(not I do not want to live next to Muslims but my friends live there and mostly they are Christians!) MOST OF MUSLIMS INCLUDING SAUDIS DO NOT AGREE WITH THE LEVEL OF RELIGION TOLERANEC IN SAUDI ARABIA, do you want to be like them and not be tolerant? It is your choice. There is absolutely FREE CHOICE IN ISLAM and NO ONE HAS TO BE MUSLIM ANYWHERE IN THE WORLD. That is mentioned in many places in Quran and I can post the verses and you verify them.

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God bless America

1:25 pm on Sunday, September 9, 2012

Quran 2:256: "There is no compulsion in religion. Verily, the Right Path has become distinct from the wrong path. Whoever disbelieves in Tâghût[] and believes in Allâh, then he has grasped the most trustworthy handhold that will never break. And Allâh is All-Hearer, All-Knower. (256)"

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God bless America

1:27 pm on Sunday, September 9, 2012

Quran 10:99 " If it had been the Lord's Will they would all have believed all who are on earth! Wilt thou then compel mankind against their will to believe! (99)"

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God bless America

1:38 pm on Sunday, September 9, 2012

Quran 42:48 "If then they turn away, We have not sent thee as a guard over them. Thy duty is but to convey (the Message). And truly when We give man a taste of Mercy from Ourselves he doth exult thereat, but when some ill happens to him, on account of the deeds which His hands have sent forth, truly then is man ungrateful! (48)"

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Jawce

2:34 pm on Sunday, September 9, 2012

GBS: I have friends who were in Egypt and ISLAM IS AN INTOLERANT RELIGION. Stop arguing with me! I am sick of your lies....your religion is Satanic and Satan is the Father Of Lies as he is the #1 Liar.....SHUT UP AND LEAVE ME ALONE.

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God bless America

4:21 pm on Sunday, September 9, 2012

Jawce: you do not talk about tolerance you are insulting me for no reason! all people can see this! I will say as my love Jesus taught me "if some one slaps you on one cheek, offer the other cheek also" so keep going insulting me! I posted too many comments here and did not insult any one not you not any one else! I said I HAVE BEEN IN EGYPT and I can prove it by showing my passport, but guess what you know more cause a friend of your friend told you :) good job!

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Jawce

4:27 pm on Sunday, September 9, 2012

GBA: if you think all americans are stupid, you are dead wrong. I know what Islam is. I know how countries who practice Islam treat people....they are SATANIC. Now stop arguing with me. SHUT UP. You are a moron with no life.

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God bless America

8:27 pm on Sunday, September 9, 2012

SZ: yes I will drive there, I know the place, close to the current location too. I will suggest this to ISBR too, why not, this is not a holy place! thanks for the information.

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TJ

10:44 pm on Monday, September 10, 2012

Why would the planning board allow a house of worship between 2 residential houses. It doesn't make sense. Would anyone like a church, a temple, a syngogue, a mosque built between their home and another especially on 3 acres. It may seem like a big lot but it is narrow meaning the houses are close to each other. The planning board won't allow a 6 foot fence in front of my house but wow they will allow a house a worship between residential homes. Mr. Chaudry just because there is a flaw in the law, it doesn't make it right. How would you like it if we build a church right next to your home and your property value diminishes and your home is no longer in the residential area you bought into. Shame on Basking Ridge for having this absurd law on the books.

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JaK

4:53 pm on Tuesday, September 11, 2012

Well TJ ....It appears the PC Planning Board picks it fights very carefully.

LC

10:54 pm on Monday, September 10, 2012

Agreed, TJ. I wonder when this part of the ordinance was passed. Perhaps when Chaudry was on the Township Committee?

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JaK

11:05 am on Tuesday, September 11, 2012

Agree! Funny how a small home improvement or child safety issue gets knocked down--but--building a Mosque in a residential area is ok???DUH! Too PC! Someone earlier said this is a victory mosque, I guess that could be it. BR lost a number of innocent victims, so why not build on the site of the victims home.

God bless America

7:26 am on Tuesday, September 11, 2012

TJ & LC: I just like it when the discussion is about the place, traffic, parking etc. this is absolutely how the discussion should be. As I said this spot is not holy. SZ suggested different place, I drove there and did not find any bigger lands or houses for sale, however I drove in the other direction Martinsville road and found a bigger LOT with no neighbors, what I am going to do is to give this number to ISBR and let see what could happen. I really care about this neighborhood as I said and it would hurt me personally if anyone decided to leave, this is good neighborhood and it should stay a good neighborhood, we should all agree on that.

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LC

10:52 am on Tuesday, September 11, 2012

Of course that's how you like it. Your book forbids speaking against the Quran and Islam. Again - as I've said before - the issue in front of the planning board can only be whether the ISBR project is in compliance with the ordinance. However - we, as FREE AMERICANS - can discuss whatever we want here. (As long as we don't get censored by the Patch - haha) If what you are saying is true about looking at another site - so be it. But I know about taqiyya and tawriya - so I won't hold my breath. It's 9/11 people - Never Forget.

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Linda Sadlouskos

11:03 am on Tuesday, September 11, 2012

Although I am happy to have opinions air here, and people respond, I ask all please not to insult others on the basis of their opinions. And a reminder that all who post on Patch, including the editors, must abide by the rules of terms of agreement of use. A governmental meeting is a different forum, with its own rules. Thanks.

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LC

11:13 am on Tuesday, September 11, 2012

Thank you, Linda. I am glad to see Patch is posting this discussion. Although I may disagree with some of the "rules" here, because I love the First Amendment of the Constitution of the USA - it is not my forum and I understand that. I don't think insults are ever helpful - I do think that facts are. : )

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God bless America

12:35 pm on Tuesday, September 11, 2012

LC: I meant I am glad to see the discussion about the effect on neighbors not about Islam. Cause as you said I like to live in free country where anyone can worship God the way she/he likes! My book does not forbid anyone of believe in whatever she/he wants as I quoted earlier from Quran, it clearly states the free believe for all. My book instead asks Muslims MANDATORY to believe in YOUR book as well as all others’ books as all came from one God! And I believe in that one God and will continue believe in him only.
There is no Tuqya or Tawreya in Islam, although those concepts you can find ONLY in Shia books. But for the Majority of Muslims LIEING was never been allowed and always been one of the biggest sins one can commit. Remember when Islam started 1500 years ago In Mecca, Muslims was under a lot of pressure and many were killed for only believing in One God! And they could have showed that they are non-Muslims, but they have NEVER done that! But kept telling the truth even when they lost their lives! Muslims had too many situations among history where they did not use lying as a method to solve any issue they faced.

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JaK

4:59 pm on Tuesday, September 11, 2012

Why push the the Mosque on your neighbors, why force and create the negativity of it all. Just go somewhere else. Be gone. Worship in another location. It pains me to see personally women wearing burqa's. Burqa's are not a religious requirement, they are worn out of choice. Who in there right mind would chose to wear burqa's, scarves etc.. not because it is religious...its about the hideous meaning of the burqa and scarves.

God bless America

7:56 pm on Tuesday, September 11, 2012

Jak: Does it bother you personally to see nuns wearing “burqa’a” or not? Does it bother you when you see religious Jewish women wearing “Burqa’a” or not? For me, I do not, I go to church and see women with their hair and see nuns with “burqa’a” and none bothers me, I see Muslim women with Burqaa and without and neither bother me.

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Jawce

8:29 pm on Tuesday, September 11, 2012

God bless America speaker is a LIAR....he does NOT love america nor does he want God to bless it.....

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Sick of it All

9:29 pm on Tuesday, September 11, 2012

This is coming out of a Nation we have given "billions" yes "billions" of your and my hard earned tax paying dollars to! And from a Nation where we supported the people so they can have a shot at Democracy.
Wow how come it's not working?

Folks wake up - everything is on the line!!!!!
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CAIRO (Reuters) - Egyptian protesters scaled the walls of the U.S. embassy on Tuesday, tore down the American flag and burned it during a protest over what they said was a film being produced in the United States that insulted Prophet Mohammad.

In place of the U.S. flag, the protesters tried to raise a black flag with the words "There is no God but God, and Mohammad is his messenger", a Reuters witness said.

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/sns-rt-us-egypt-usa-protestbre88a11n-20120911,0,4413914.story

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LC

10:58 pm on Tuesday, September 11, 2012

Yep- SOIA- it's part of the plan. I just got home from a special 9/11 meeting and the film "The Third Jihad" was shown. Every American should watch it. I think you may be able to find it online.

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God bless America

6:57 am on Wednesday, September 12, 2012

Just few points for your information:
1. I am not Chaudry not any board member in Islamic society of Basking ridge, I am just a person who believes in one God and want all to live in peace.
2. What happened in Cairo – although I do not agree with it as many other Muslims- is a reaction for the movie talking bad about Prophet Muhammad that is why they attacked the embassy.
3. LC: in the memorial of 9/11 we all remember those innocent people killed, asked for them to be in better place, patience for their beloved ones, and pray to God to save all of us and let us live in peace. But apparently you have a better plan to go watch a bad movie about Islam!

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LC

9:31 am on Wednesday, September 12, 2012

Oh - silly me. Storming the American Embassy on 9/11, decimating the American flag and replacing it with the black flag of Islam and MURDERING the US Ambassador is explained by a 15 minute internet film that criticizes Mohammed, a child rapist.

I recommend everyone watch the film I saw last night (that GBA calls a "bad film about Islam") The Third Jihad. It is full of translated Al Jazeera messages and explains the radical Islamic movement to create an Islamic world - here in the USA.ALSO - of MOST importance to this thread - it explains the ISNA and CAIR connections to the Muslim Brotherhood. Chaudry is QUOTED on Patch as being an admirer of ISNA and has a link to it on ISBR's website. He is also a "fan" of CAIR-NJ on his FB page. WAKE UP - Basking Ridge.

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LC

9:33 am on Wednesday, September 12, 2012

By the way - the film The Third Jihad is not some Muslim-bashing piece. It is narrated by a TRULY peaceful Muslim - a US physician and is full of Islamic experts such as Dr. Whalid Phares. It is a truly riveting film. I think you can watch it on Youtube.

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God bless America

9:40 am on Wednesday, September 12, 2012

Jawce: the reaction by those people is not right and not acceptable, and not encouraged by any religion. All Mosques, churches and temples and the world do not worth killing ONE human being. Many believers (as for me) will NOT kill a cat to defend Prophet Mohammed or to defend Moses or Jesus. You said that Jesus can defend himself, that’s why he did not even try to kill or hurt people tried to hurt and kill him many times! Same for Mohammed he did not kill or hurt anyone for what he believes in, even after Mecca got into Islam people there expected he would kill them in return for what they did, but he did not kill anyone but forgive them! That being said: that forgiveness is required by all people, that what we should have but it does not justify we insult each and insult our prophets, and mimic our examples and leaders. That would not take us anywhere but to conflicts. I expect tolerance and forgiveness for all people as example from Buddhists that does not justify I can make fun of Buddha!

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God bless America

9:40 am on Wednesday, September 12, 2012

I was in a Muslim country when the movie passion of Christ was in theaters, so some people opposed that movie! I did not know are they Christians or Muslims, but when I asked and read, they were both! And their point was not the material or if the movie talks good or bad about Jesus, but the idea is not accepted to bring an actor and make him acting he is the Christ! That is the part that is not acceptable in that part of the world it is a respect for Jesus, you cannot even put a normal human being pretending Jesus!

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God bless America

9:43 am on Wednesday, September 12, 2012

LC: as I said nothing justify hurting a cat! I am so sad for the people lost today God have mercy on them not sure who did it but whoever did it is mistaken and should be punished.
I cannot comment on the movie if it is good or bad, after I watch I can do so. I said a bad movie about Islam as I read on BBC.

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Truth and Reason

8:01 am on Friday, April 26, 2013

Let's not be naive. Islam is being called into question on these matters for good reason. There is nothing bigoted or prejudiced about asking how a rapidly growing community of Muslims in Somerset County does not represent a threat of opening doors for extreme Islamic radicals or becoming that way itself. What happens if the mosque gets vandalized or someone ignorantly defames Allah or burns a Quran, will there be a holy war here in Liberty Corner? We live in a time where radical Islam is on the rise as fast a rate or faster than moderate Islam. Don't be naive just so you are not called an "Islamaphobe" or considered backwards. Do the research.
See: http://www.thereligionofpeace.com/pages/americanattacks.htm

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Lawyer1

8:48 am on Friday, April 26, 2013

Bigotry has nothing to do with it .....IMO. Facts are these peoples are being financed by Saudis and this movement is being conducted across the country not just here in LC or Bridgewater. IMO....it's an attempt to use our own laws to undermine our way of life here....it's obvious. The Saudi'd financed 911 and this IMO is their Phase 2.....we're just foolish enough to permit this type of infiltration to happen right before our eyes. Bridgewater already has 2 Mosques within a few blocks of each other with another proposed in a secluded area on the mountain.....IMO.....spreading much like ants..

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